Buying a House? What Not to Plant + Red Flags on the Landscape

Josh Van Kemp from Davey's Toronto East office shares his tree tips when buying a new house or selling your current one. Josh shares his list of trees to not plant on your property, trees he recommends planting, best trees for privacy and some potential red flags to keep an eye out for. 

In this episode we cover:

• Positives and negatives of having mature trees (0:40)
• Free consultations (3:51)
• Pesticide and fungicide (5:07)
• Knowing if a big tree is too close to the foundation (6:24)
• Planting a new, young tree in the appropriate spot (7:39)
• What to look for on trees when looking at a potential property (8:26)
• Trees to avoid planting near the foundation (10:01)
• Best trees for privacy screening (12:29)
• Josh's list of trees to not plant! (13:01)
• Josh's list of best trees to plant (16:46)
• How Josh started his job (18:56)

To find your local Davey office, check out our find a local office page to search by zip code.

To learn more tree care tips when buying or selling a house, check out our Homeowner blogs for Landscaping, Curb Appeal and Adding Value to Your Property.
To  learn more about buying a house mature trees near the foundation, read our blog, Buying a House with Big, Mature Trees Near the House or Foundation.

Connect with Davey Tree Expert Company of Canada, Ltd.  on social media:
Instagram: @daveytreecanada

Connect with Davey Tree on social media:
Twitter: @DaveyTree
Facebook: @DaveyTree
Instagram: @daveytree
YouTube: The Davey Tree Expert Company
LinkedIn: The Davey Tree Expert Company

Have topics you'd like us to cover on the podcast? Email us at podcasts@davey.com. We want to hear from you!

Transcript

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Intro: Welcome to the Davey Tree Expert Company's podcast, Talking Trees. I'm your host, Doug Oster. Each episode showcases one of Davey's certified arborists sharing advice with everyone about caring for your trees and landscapes. We'll talk about everything from introduced pests, seasonal tree care, deer damage, how to make your trees thrive, and much, much more. Tune in every Thursday to learn more because here at the Talking Trees podcast, we know trees are the answer.

Doug Oster: I'm joined this week by Josh Van Kemp. He works out of the Toronto East Office up in Canada, for the Davey Tree Expert Company, as a district manager. I'm going to start off, Josh, picking your brain a little bit about if you're thinking about buying a house, when you see lots of big mature trees around a house, what are the positives of that?

Josh Van Kemp: Hey, Doug. Some of the positives in terms of mature trees, obviously, we've got the aesthetics of a large, beautiful tree. It brings a lot of value to a home. I don't know about you, but when I drive up and down a street and I see a street with a lot of nice mature trees, it's very welcoming. A lot of the positives there are it offers some shade to the neighborhood and things like that. It's going to obviously help with cooling costs on the home.

You've also got the opportunity there to dampen the light in your backyard. If you're lucky enough to have a large mature tree where that sunlight dances through the branches, so to speak, it adds another aspect to the backyard aesthetically. With that being said, you've also inherited probably a tree that might take 20, 30, 40 years to grow. That has a value on its own as well.

There's also the mental health side of things. There's a lot of studies shown in terms of mental health improvements, with hospitals and retirement homes that have a lot of green space on them. I'd say there's a lot of value to having a mature tree on your property, let alone any trees and greenery. Definitely, if you're lucky enough to inherit a property that has a mature tree, yes, a lot of positives there.

Doug: How about negatives? When I talk to arborists on this podcast all the time, I tell them I live in an oak forest. A very mature oak forest, and one actually with oak wilt. When I think of looking at a house with big giant trees, it can be worrisome also, right?

Josh: Yes, that's true. A lot of times, we look at trees, sometimes we forget that they need love and they need attention. You can almost compare it to your car. Your car needs love, it needs attention, needs oil changes. We've got to put some investment in there. It's important to realize that by inheriting trees of any size, there's going to be some investment.

Younger trees, obviously, you're probably not going to have such a large investment at a younger age. As they grow, you're going to see certain things change. With that being said, what are you going to see? You're going to see some deadwood through the tree, that's going to have to be taken care of. There's going to be a little of a cost for that. You might see some pest management or disease management that might need to happen with the tree to keep it healthy.

Again, these are all things that here at Davey Tree, we have the ability to take care of and assist with. You can always give us a call. It's a free consultation, things like that. That's something where we come out, we do a nice assessment of the tree and we do a little bit of a risk assessment. Even in terms of, if you're looking to buy a tree, you can always give us a call, and we can come out, and check the property before you make those kind of commitments to a property.

Doug: Talking about coming out for free, some people might be shy to call. "Gee, do I really want to have a guy come out? Is it going to be bothering him?" This is your job, right? You want people to do this.

Josh: Yes, that's what I do all day, every day, I talk about trees. I probably drive my family crazy talking about trees. I know I drive my wife crazy talking about trees. I drive up and down streets and what do I notice? I go [unintelligible 00:04:25] "Somebody's got to take care of that deadwood in that tree, or I wonder if those people know that tree's got that disease and it's causing the leaves to fall."

A simple spray a couple of times a year in the spring would solve the problem, and it would change the value of that tree from something that looks sickly to something that would bring that value back to the front yard, so to speak, that curb appeal. Sometimes people don't realize that and I think the tree care industry gets chalked up to just pretty much branch cutting or tree removal all the time. It's always the physical aspect of removing something.

Here at Davey, we do so much more. We have the ability, pesticide licenses, things like that.

The word pesticide can be scary for some people, but that also means fungicides. Fungicides, we can treat these trees, and we can solve these problems, and help control these problems. It's relatively surprising to most people when I go out and I explain that to them and they go, "Oh, I thought I was going to have to remove this tree. We bought the house four years ago and it's been here with us this whole time. We raised our kids with this tree and I'd hate to see it go."

When I could come in, I can offer them this integrated pest management program, this tree and shrub care program. It brings a lot of value to my day. To say that people are worried that they're wasting my time, there's a lot of value for me when I can see people appreciate the change in their landscape and the things I can do to help them create that change. Give us a call, there's no issue.

Doug: Your wife and your family might not want to hear that diatribe, but here on the Talking Trees podcast, that's all we want to hear. [laughs]

Josh: I'll call you next time, Doug, instead of talking to my wife. How's that sound?

Doug: Sounds good. Let's get back to looking at our property. How do I know if a big tree is too close to the foundation?

Josh: If it's too close to the foundation, generally, a good rule of thumb is you look at the drip line of the tree. The drip line is where the edge of the canopy reaches. It's like where the edge of the last leaf reaches on the top of the tree. That's generally a good rule of thumb. You can use that in the sense that that's where your tree roots are reaching to.

They probably go a little bit further than that. I get this question a lot. A lot of people are worried about tree roots in their foundation. A lot of the times, we don't see issues with tree roots affecting foundation. It's a pretty big concern, especially here in Toronto, we got a lot of small properties, but we got a lot of big trees. Those roots, they've been there for maybe a hundred years on some of these large oak trees.

If people have issues with the foundation, it's usually because there's a pre-existing problem. Tree roots naturally look for water, but they're not going to punch through a wall to try to find that water. If you're finding that there's any problems with foundation and it has to do with the tree roots, it's probably because the foundation was damaged already. With that being said, if you have the ability to plant a tree, if we're talking about planting a new young tree, take that into consideration. Keep it away from the house.

Let's plant at an appropriate location, especially based off the size and the root structure for that tree, because we're going to have to take that into consideration. Some trees get quite large, other trees have a little more of a small form and therefore, certain tree roots might not impact the foundation as much. If we can avoid the tree roots growing along the foundation, then why not? Let's go that route.

If you have an existing tree that's already there, again, have somebody come out. We can assess the tree. We can determine if those roots would probably be affecting the foundation and we can make the best recommendations from there.

Doug: I think I already know the answer to the next question. Let's say I'm looking at a property, and there's a big tree, and there's deadwood on it. Maybe it's scraping off the roof. That's certainly a bad thing.

Josh: Yes, it's definitely not a good thing. We want to enjoy our trees but we also want to make sure that we're creating a balance between our landscape, and our own homes, and our livelihood. We don't want these trees scratching the roof, we don't want them-- In the winter, we got a lot of weighted limbs, maybe due to ice rain, they're freezing to the shingles.

They might lift the shingles when there's some thaw because they're frozen together. These are things we look at as arborists, and we come out and we assess. A lot of times, we'll make recommendations for obviously removing deadwood because it's a hazard. The other things are like elevating over the roofline. Giving ample clearances over the roof, so we keep some wildlife off the tree or off the roof, if we can do that.

Another good thing to consider is pruning tree limbs away from chimney stacks. A lot of people don't consider that and then they go and they use their chimneys in the winter, and it is a little bit of a fire hazard. It's something to definitely take into consideration for the safety of your family and your home. Again, we come out, we assess that tree, and those are the recommendations that we can make, because a lot of people sometimes don't think about these things, and that's where a certified arborist comes into play.

Doug: Especially, I never thought of that, something growing over the chimney stack. That's a great point. I want to go back to something you said though, about trees and foundation. Are there any trees that I would want to avoid to plant within a certain distance with my foundation, or that's just something I shouldn't really worry too much about? Like you, I get that question a lot where people say like, "Oh gosh, I don't want to have a tree close to here because the roots are going to go into the house." But from what you just said, generally that's not a big concern.

Josh: No, generally is not a huge concern with that. If we were to consider certain trees not to plant, I think just in relation to the home. Obviously, we want to try to avoid fast-growing trees. Fast-growing trees are quick to grow, but they're also quick to die. They can be problematic because of that. We want to encourage long-live, slow growing, shade trees in our communities. These are going to offer the best value to the canopy coverage of our communities and to obviously help with that carbon footprint.

With that being said, certain species that I would avoid myself and I would recommend to some of my customers to avoid. I would avoid willows. I would avoid poplars. These are two very fast-growing trees. They're not very appropriate for most urban environments. Now if you've got the space, if you're lucky enough to have a property that's quite large, then by all means, there's a time and place for everything.

Some of these trees can be very beautiful if they have the space to grow. Those would be probably the two most common trees that I would advise homeowners to avoid planting. Sometimes people want that privacy screen of a tree planted at the back of the lot. Let it grow quick. You don't want to have to be looking into your neighbor's yard all the time, and I respect that, but again, picking the right tree for the right place is very important.

It will save you money in the long run, because if you choose the right tree, it means you can invest in that tree more appropriately. The last thing we want is a large growing tree that is very fast-growing, and we have to put an investment into it consistently just to try to maintain its size. It grows fast and that's great. It does what it needs to do very quickly, but it also becomes a problem very quickly. With that being said, there are species of trees that we can plant that would be more appropriate for things like that, for privacy screens.

Trees coming all different shapes and sizes. We can get things like Columnars or pure middles, which are more narrow, upright growing trees. They've been designed to grow like this, and they're usually very beautiful when used in the right setting. These are some trees that I would recommend for that, is looking for Columnars and pure middle species to create privacy screens, if you're looking to do something like that.

Doug: I want to pivot a little bit and I want to pick your brain a little bit. Do you have two or three trees on your list that you say, please don't plant this. Please don't plant this. This is not going to be something that you're going to want to have in your landscape.

Josh: Trees not to plant. 100% don't plant. Definitely the poplar falls into that category.

Doug: When you say that poplar, it's so funny because where I grew up, that house that we bought in 1967 had a whole row of poplars in front of it as a screen. By the time that I graduated high school, that whole row of poplars was gone.

Josh: They're lovely trees, again, in the right setting, but they take a lot of maintenance and their longevity, the age that they live, is something that we have to consider when choosing trees as well. Some trees might have a lifespan of 40 to 60 years in optimal conditions. Other trees might have a lifespan of 150 years. Again, it's one of those things where you got to take it into consideration. If you plan on living on that property for quite some time, are you going to out live the tree?

Are you going to live on that property longer than the tree, or are you going to have to deal that tree within 30 years because it might become a problem? To answer your question, 100% poplar. Beautiful tree in the right setting. For most urban dwellers, I would avoid it. Other trees that I know in my neighborhood that we would probably avoid, one of them would be Norway Maples.

Now this isn't so much because of the type of tree, but it's because it is becoming an invasive species for us here in Ontario. It's starting to outcompete our native trees. We're having a hard time with Sugar Maples and red Maples in our native forests. It's strictly an evolutionary thing. The Norway maple just produces that much more seed crop when compared to a sugar maple or a red maple.

It's literally just a numbers game for the trees, but if we can discourage the planting of Norway Maples in our communities, and probably encourage more native trees like sugar Maples or red Maples, or even Freeman Maples, which is a little bit of a hybridized species there. There's different things to talk about there as well, but we try to choose certain species that also work for our communities. Not only work for the homeowner, but work for our environment in the long run.

Doug: Almost every arborist I talk to talks about how great sugar Maples are. We have the same problem with Norway Maples down here in the east, just out competing the better trees. Anything else on your list?

Josh: In terms of trees to avoid? I think that really comes down to the questions I would probably ask a homeowner at that point. You got to pick their brains on what they want to achieve in their yard. Are we looking for a large form tree? Are we looking for something tall and narrow? Are we looking for something more widespread that provides lots of shade or minimal shade? Maybe people just want an ornamental, something that provides a little more color to the environment. I think it really comes down to preference at that point. There's pros and cons with most trees, but those would be the two I would avoid. It's funny, because if you ask me what are my favorite trees to plant--

Doug: That was my next question.

Josh: I'm sure it's your next question. [laughs] I would say there's one that's always on the fence and it's Ginkgo. Ginkgo's a beautiful tree, has a beautiful fan shape. There's really no other leaf like it. It's a prehistoric tree. It's been around for ages, literally the mammals that used to roam the earth, that used to crush these seeds, don't exist anymore. The only reason this tree exists is because we as humans cultivate it, but a beautiful tree. It's always funny because I recommend it quite often to homeowners.

The first thing they do is they go home and they look it up and they see all the negative opinions on the fruit. It's always so funny because the female produces a seed and the seed is very smelly when it gets broken open. The pro, beautiful tree, beautiful colors in the fall, especially here in Ontario, we have very, very slow, slow falls, steady temperature changes so we get beautiful colors. You really learn to appreciate a tree like that in the fall, but again, you take a little bit of that risk with that fruit and you hope that you don't get that odd tree that is a female and not a male.

Doug: When they're selling a Ginkgo, you don't know if it's male or female. Is that how it works or?

Josh: Generally they're grown to be a male tree, but the odd time you do get unlucky and end up with a female. It's maybe like a one in a 100 chance, but--

Doug: Just my luck.

Josh: I think it's worth the risk. Yes. They're good trees. They're easy trees to prune. They have good form, very narrow trees. Generally they work well within an urban environment and it's something different. Having a little bit of variety in the neighborhood. Being that homeowner says you got a different tree than everybody else is a nice thing to say, I think.

Doug: Here in Pittsburgh, when I'm driving down to the city, they have a whole row of them next to the freeway and when they change color, it is stunning. It is absolutely stunning. Beautiful color. Tell me a little bit about how you got into this. It's something I always like to ask arborists.

Josh: From a young age, I always enjoyed being outdoors. My parents took me camping when I was quite young. I just grew up with that exposure to the outdoors, to trees. My mother always felt it was really important that I learn about the outdoors and so I was absorbing that information all the time. As I got older, you hit that point in high school, they start saying, well, what are you going to do with your life? You sit down, you start looking at things and you go, "Okay. I could be an accountant, I could be a doctor. I could be a lawyer. I could be a police officer."

Then somebody says, "Well what about working with natural resources, working outdoors? You always enjoy being outdoors." I started really looking into things, and I found this program. It was a forestry program, Fleming College. Sandford Fleming College here in Lindsay, Ontario. They're basically just a natural resource campus. They have a whole bunch of different programs that range from drilling and blasting, to fisheries, to forestry, to arboriculture. We actually bring on a lot of our new climbers from their arboriculture program there and co-op students. I did these two-year program in forestry and I learned a lot.

You learn a lot through osmosis with all those other individuals that are in different natural resource programs, so very good program. Then from there, I actually went out to Vancouver Island University in BC, and I studied a little bit of natural resource law and kind of dipped my toes in more of the report writing side of things, and so yes, I had a little bit of the hands on experience, a little bit of the report writing side of things. I ended up back here in Ontario or On Terrible as everybody called it from BC, and everybody thought I was crazy for leaving the west coast of Canada.

I dabbled a bit in running my own business and I kind of got the taste for doing sales and bringing together tree care plans for homeowners. I really learned to appreciate the value of meeting with people and providing a service and seeing that return when it was done, and letting them enjoy their property. I started really looking around. I said, where can I get this exposure and can I do this as a full-time job? Davey Tree has always been a pretty strong name in the industry. I started looking at things here and I saw they have sales arborist positions. They have pest management technician programs. They have different kinds of training.

They have the Davey Institute of tree sciences, a program that runs for a month-long and is down in Ohio there. All these little things that really helped build a good picture of what my career could look like and where I could grow. Davey has been very good to me. I've had a lot of opportunities here. I've grown a lot both as an arborist and as a person. There's a lot of different things I've taken on and things that I don't think I would've learned anywhere else. I've always really appreciated that and the amount of knowledge that was able for me to absorb working for Davey Tree. That's my little life story in a nutshell.

Doug: All right, Josh, I'm going to leave it right there. I know you love the outdoors because before we started doing our podcast, you're going to one of my favorite places in the world, Algonquin provincial park. That's as outdoorsy as it gets. Then if you ever have any time when you're going to start talking about trees and your wife just turns you off, just give me a call and we can chat about it, all right?

Josh: All right, sounds good, Doug.

Doug: Thank you so much, Josh. I appreciate your time.

Josh: Thank you very much. Have a good day.

Doug: Tune in every Thursday to the Talking Trees podcast from the Davey Tree Expert Company. I'm your host, Doug Oster. Next week, we're talking all about jobs in arboriculture. I interviewed a current and former intern with Davey Tree. I really enjoyed getting their perspective on the job. As always, we like to remind you on the Talking Trees podcast, trees are answer.

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